iNomis

This is the total history of my sale of a refurbished Cappresso Ultima Espresso machine through Paypal via Ebay. It will be my last sale. I feel this is going to get worse. I’ll see how much pain I can bear before I give in to this mess Paypal, ebay and my buyer have created. I accept that I’m holding the knife but they are the ones pushing on the blade, or something like that.

This is the item.
You can see the seller, look up her comments, my response etc.

The History - In Reverse Chronological Blocks

Dealing with Paypal - She Returns Item- maybe?

September 9, 2008 - email from Pay Pal

We have determined that your buyer is entitled to a refund for this transaction. To receive this refund, the buyer must return the item to you and provide us with their shipping information. Once we verify this information, we will issue the buyer a refund from your PayPal account. Please note, the buyer is responsible for the cost of returning the item to you.

We apologize for the difficulties you had with this transaction and truly hope that you find this resolution to be fair and reasonable for everyone involved.

Sincerely,

PayPal

Oh yes, I’m sure I think it’s fair to impose the buyer’s will on the seller no matter what. No, what they “sincerely” think is that a nice sounding note will sucker me in to using Paypal for anything ever again. Not going to work on me.

September 13, 2008 - Email from Paypal

PayPal has received online tracking information for the return of your
item(s):

Tracking Company: USPS
Tracking Number: 03062400000146519795

You can resolve this case faster by logging in and indicating that you have received the returned item. This will release the refund to the buyer automatically. If you do not report the item returned, PayPal will verify the tracking information and release the refund for you with no penalty.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Sincerely,

Protection Services Department

Oh yes, I’m highly motivated to let you know I got the item so the buyer can get their money faster. No, the only way I will contact you is if the item comes to me with any sort of damage. Actually I may contact and hold paypal accountable for her returning the item with the internal damage she described. I will certainly make official complaints to paypal, ebay, their states officials, the USPS and any federal agencies I can think of that are somewhat appropriate.

As an interesting tidbit, I got a spam email from somewhere trying to get me to claim my Paypal refund of some other transaction gone bad. Maybe the spammers follow obvious disputes and after so many days send something out?

Dealing with Paypal - Initial

August 30, 2008
Get email from Paypal that the buyer has filed a dispute with the sale. Boy this was a big surprise!

August 30 - September 8, 2008
There is some history here trying to email paypal responses via their contact page but you need to call the secret number below to do anything at all. Luckily(probably only for them I suppose) someone gave me the secret number in the 2nd or 3rd unhelpful “We are glad to help you.” reply they sent to me. Also, the dispute was escalated to a complaint. Dispute means we want to take your money. Claim means we will take your money.

September 8, 2008
Spoke with an agent on the 1-888-221-1161 secret support number. Perhaps it’s only secret to those with cancelled accounts but I can’t find it anywhere. Anyway she says that they can’t make the buyer help me with insurance and that the buyer will need to ship the item back to me and I will need to take care of the insurance. This is in direct conflict with the USPS rules regarding how they say to handle damage claims so I fully expect my local USPS to deny any claim I make. The agent had an accent like Sarah Palin(not getting my vote anyway), and held the company line. She said she understood what I was saying about the USPS rules but that they cannot force the buyer to deal with the insurance. She also said BS about it’s not the buyers responsibility to go to the USPS to do this etc. OK, they are going to make her send the machine back to me but they can’t make them take a trip to the USPS to show them the box? WHAT???

In other words the buyer is free to do whatever they want as long as they tell Paypal they are sending the machine back and I have no idea how they will verify or follow up on that.

The Fear
August 24, 2008
Buyer files negative ebay feedback. My 26 100% rating goes to 50% as they now only count things from the last 12 months. I guess it will go to zero for a while once the other feedback rolls off. Fearing a disgruntled buyer going further postal on me and remembering and researching the actions of Paypal against sellers, I removed my account information from Paypal and closed my Paypal accounts.

August 25, 2008
I made photocopies of the USPS insurance receipt and got everything together to send to the buyer so she could file the claim. Then I decided to wait just a bit to see what would happen. If I sent her the receipt, she would have everything if paypal stole my money.

The Beginning

August 19, 2008 - Sold item on ebay. Buyer sent payment same day. Good. I thought.

August 20, 2008 - I should have started having doubts about this buyer when she did not understand the USPS tracking information.

August 23 & 24, 2008 - Buyer sent 3 messages in 30 minutes. Third after talking with Cappresso and saying the machine is not working and that she wants to send it back for a refund. I responded:

Dear cusitin,

I’m very sorry you are having a problem with the machine. It was working properly before shipment. Perhaps something came
loose during shipment? I know there is a small hose that attaches to two ends up inside the machine. Maybe that came
loose? I guess the all the fragile stamps on the box didn’t make much difference to them.

I will gladly work with you however I can to resolve any damage that occurred in shipping, that is what we paid insurance for. I do not offer refunds of any kind.

http://www.usps.com/insuranceclaims/domestic.htm

It appears that either you or I can file the insurance claim but that the filer will need the original insurance receipt(which I can
send you) and that you will need to retain all packing materials to present for their inspection. Let me know how you would like to proceed with this.

I believe the flat rate repair to the machine was $69 for me so you may want to claim insurance for that amount and have it
repaired rather than the full amount as then you make have to surrender the machine. Just a thought.

Again, I am sorry that this occurred. I hope we can get it resolved to your satisfaction.

Karl

Dear inomis,

With all due respect, I must disagree with you that the problem is due to shipping. As you aware, the item came fully intact wrapped securely within TWO BOXES. There were no damages to the any of the boxes and the item was very secure inside its own box and was placed between two styrofoams. The item arrived in one piece with no damage whatsoever. It was very clear once I turned the machine on that the item came to me with this problem already in place. I confirmed when I called up Capresso. I will not file an insurance claim because it was not due to shipping. I also checked your listing and it clearly states: “The seller, inomis, assumes full responsibility for the content of this listing and the item offered.” I’m sorry to say that if I do not receive a full refund, I will take all measures within my control to do whatever I have to obtain a FULL refund for this item. You would not like someone to do this to you if you purchased an item in this condition.

- cusitin

And immediately another, maybe ebay limits the size of your response?

Dear inomis,

continued…….

I would be more than happy to resolve this problem with you in order to avoid negative feedback on your end, and filing a claim. I have 100% rating and have never had a problem with anyone. As I’m sure you can see, this is simply unfair and extremely inconvenient on my end. It is very clear that this item was shipped without being tested since you had it refurbished.

Awaiting an amicable reply,

Mari

To which I responded:

Dear cusitin,

I do not know what to say. The machine was used by myself since refurbishment and it worked just like it did when new. Like
you I have 100% feedback. Please respect that I do and what I say about this machine is true.

I am 100% responsible for what I said in the listing and the contents I placed in the box to send to you. USPS is responsible
once they accept it. It would be equally unfair and inconvenient for me to assume the responsibility of USPS shipping no matter how improbable you or they feel the damage was caused by them. I will work with you on the insurance if you choose that route.

Karl

- inomis

And her …

Dear inomis,

The same way you’re asking me to respect that what you say about the machine is true, I’m asking you to respect the fact that what I say about the shipping is true. There is absolutely no damage whatsoever to the box. It came clean and in perfect condition. There is no possibility you or I could file an insurance claim because it will be denied once they look at the box. I took pictures of the box, the way it was shipped, and of the machine at all angles. No damage whatsoever! I also took pictures of the water coming out from the bottom of the tray. Nothing comes out of the spout! Everything comes out from the bottom tray?! This is a pre-existing condition. The carousel that it came with has never been used. Therefore, I believe the machine was not used after refurbishment. The other carousel that came in separately in the box was used but that’s not the issue. Filing an insurance claim is not the way to resolve this; therefore, I will not be discussing that as an alternati

- cusitin

Dear inomis,

Continued….

Since you are 100% responsible for what was placed in the contents of the box, a refund should be given because you sent me a defective product. As I said before USPS has nothing to do with this. I have everything to prove it. Let me know what you are considering so that I can continue from here. I have contacted Ebay and it is YOUR responsibility to make sure that the product is not defective and if it is then a refund should be given. If you are set on not giving a refund, it is unfortunate to say that I will be filing several claims through multiple sites.

I’m sure we can avoid this with a simple refund, but you hold the key to deciding whether this issue can drag on or get resolved.

Thank you.
Mari

And finally my last reply…

Dear cusitin,

As you do not seem to want me to work with you, I will be sending the insurance receipt to you to do as you wish. I’m am truly sorry for any difficulties this has caused you. If you wish to make my life difficult because of damage occurring in shipment then I’m sure that will be easy to do. I wish you would not, but I have done nothing wrong and things out of my control apparently have. I hope any actions you take will bring you peace.

Karl

- inomis

And now her last contact with me that day or directly:

Dear inomis,

You have done plenty wrong…..

1) insisting that the damage was due to shipping instead of accepting responsibility for the product you sold;

2) not providing a refund for a defective product and blaming it on someone else.

Again, you are not accepting responsibility for the product you sold and your listing says you are responsible 100% for its contents!

I don’t want to work with you??? What’s your reason for not giving a refund?? Why are you insisting so much that it was damaged due to shipping? How is it possible that a machine can be damaged inside with no visible damage outside? If something came loose inside then the machine was already defective don’t you see that?? It seems that you had this all planned with the insurance story…. can’t see how someone whose listing says he will be responsible for the contents, now refuses to give a refund?

I guess you chose not to use your key…..wrong decision.

- cusitin